WrightwoodCalif.com Forum
Public Forums => Disaster Awareness & CERT => Topic started by: lzuber on Jun 28, 04, 04:22:49 AM
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i was hoping that if i didn't think about it, it won't happen. ::)
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Nope, not even a little bit prepared, never experianced a quake, not quite sure what to expect or how to prepare.
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We've got that number for nine one one posted on that thar fridge, so we's ready. :D
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We have EQ insurance, but that's about it. I had all of our supplies in easy to haul trash cans at one point, but when we moved and I checked them out, they were all out of date and had to be tossed.
I DO plan to get my stuff together again within the next few weeks - was hoping the big one doesn't come prior to summer when I had more time!
It is important to have an out-of-state number everyone can carry with them. Local lines may be down, and it's nice to call someone (relative, friends) out of state and share where you are and how you are with your family. It's very easy to get separated and not be able to catch up with each other without that call.
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EARTHQUAKE TRUE STORY
January 17, 1994 4:17 A.M. Northridge, California
As a native Californian I have managed to experience some big 'uns....
Most notably, we found out that the house we were living in was on top of the (until then unknown) NORTHRIDGE FAULT LINE. This was NOT a nice surprise at 4:17 a.m., nor would it be at ANY time!
Our pool dumped the top 3 feet of water out... now that is an amazing thing to see happen (of course we did not see that until a later earthquake that occurred during daylight hours).
The house sounded like a train rushing headlong into a glass factory... You can not imagine how much glass you have in your house until you experience one of these events!
KEEP SHOES AT YOUR BEDSIDE THAT YOU CAN FIND IN THE DARK!!!
We had a 20 gallon fishtank crash over onto the TV.
The TV in the bedroom joined us IN BED and would have broken our legs EXCEPT we had been spun completely sideways in a waterbed with satin sheets. But we did clonk our heads pretty good on the sideboards and we couldn't get out of the bed with the slippery sheets.
DON'T KEEP ANYTHING HEAVY OVER THE HEAD OF YOUR BED!!
Our stove marched across the kitchen where it crashed into the fridge. All the cupboards emptied themselves onto the floor.
Our one ton 1977 Dodge van jumped up on top of our 12 inch curb out front of the house and dropped it's drive shaft.
The electrical transformers blew so there was no electricity and no street lights.
Telephone service was shut down at daybreak for some reason.
We tried to sleep on the lawn but it was like a herd of buffalo kept running under us and throwing us up into the air.
Packs of dogs ran screaming up and down the street, lost, because the walls that had always kept them in their yards had gone down and they did not know where they lived.
We turned our gas off at the meter.... and then couldn't get it turned back on for a month because everyone else had done the same thing and the gas company just didn't have enough employees to get the job done.
The Northridge Quake was initially given a 7.2 rating.
When area homeowners began their exodus out of the area the Richter rating was mysteriously lowered to 6.8. I think they did this in an attempt to maintain the property values. No luck.... Northridge was perhaps as much as 30% vacant with condemned and abandoned houses for a year or two...
Some damaged properties are STILL tied up in litigation with insurance companies that went bankrupt or defaulted on payments due.
Until the banks finally dropped the prices enough to sell them, the empty houses were attracting squatters and gangs.
OH WHAT FUN THESE SHAKERS ARE!!!! Fun. Right.
Earlier this year I found out that my house here in WW is practically on top of the San Andreas Fault Line in the San Gabriel Mountains.
Yeehaw.... I'M STILL NOT LEAVIN' WRIGHTWOOD.
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I'm in the process of getting us ready again. It seems you get ready, then time goes by and your stored things become outdated. Eventually you use all the bandaids in your kit for a summer's worth of scraped knees, you scavenge the blankets, clothes and other things, and then finally trash gets thrown in the earthquake bin.
So I'm officially adding getting prepared as another summer project.
Here's what I'm doing.....
Getting a new trashcan and filling it with the holey blankets that I am about to throw out, bandaids, a change of clothes for each of us, first aid supplies, general medicines like Advil, and some long storing food supplies AND a can opener.
I'll get the flashlights back near each bed and in specific parts of the house....with working batteries.
The bedside drawers will also get a crowbar. (I remember in Northridge reading that many people got trapped in their bedrooms for a time because their doors were just tweaked enough not to open.)
I'll pack a small bag for each vehicle with a blanket, some water packs and a few cheapy granola bars, a crowbar and some first aid supplies.
I'll get some gallon water bottles to have on hand.
I'll also clear a path to the camping gear and get the lantern where I can reach it and tape the matches onto the base.
And I'll make sure that there's a clear path to every exit each night free of shoes, laundry baskets, and clutter. This is a good thing anyway due to fire, but I'll redouble my efforts on this.
And I'll try to remember the shoe thing. I had heard that was a problem for a lot of people in Northridge.
I found the water main switch, and will find the gas shut off, but I'll try and remember NOT to turn it off unless I have to. That was a HUGE problem in Northridge.
I'll keep the cell phone charged so that if there's a tower working I will be able to use it for emergency calls. And I think I'll spend 20 minutes loading more phone numbers onto the cell so that I'll have them if I need them.
Still can't decide about earthquake insurance. It seems so expensive and I just can't imagine that they would actually be solvent should the big one hit.
Oh, and here's a funny idea I heard once....put a Bible and a bottle of booze in your earthquake kit. In case of the Big One, you may want one or both.
Laura
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Well, it sounds like you will be really ready, how about just adding enough for five more and we will just come to your place ;).
Thanks for the list, it gives me a place to start, and a reason to wonder if I wouldn't rather have stayed in tornado country at least you usually get a warning about those.
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I'll help you if you need more ideas. If I'm prepared, it's off my mind. It's getting caught without being ready that freaks me out!
Let me know if you need more ideas.
Laura
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We had a discussion about earthquake safety at work just last week! One of our empoyees stated he had purchased pre-prepared kits (someone else said you can buy them at Sports Chalet or Big 5 Sporting goods) that has all the supplies needed like a crank radio, flashlights, emergency food rations, etc. You can get individual or for 4 people packs. You do need to keep a fresh water supply. We are thinking of going to costco and getting some flats of drinking water. Does anyone know how long bottled water lasts?
We are also in the process of using the "quakehold" products to secure our NUMEROUS bookshelves to the wall, and we have already used their picture hanging products to hang all of our pictures. They won't come off the wall in a minor shaker....
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Most important home preparedness tasks:
1. Be sure your water heater is strapped to the wall at the studs.
2. Attach all large, tall, or heavy furniture to the walls. Securely.
3. Your bed should not be directly under a window. If it has to be, coat the window in
clear film that is designed to make it shatter proof.
4. Install baby safety locks on cabinet doors that contain heavy items or breakable
items.
5. Attach a wrench, with a light chain to your gas meter. Know how to turn it off. Know
when to turn to it off. Only if you smell gas. Don't just shut it off because of a little
temblor.
6. All fire departments now strongly advise against the use of candles, and Propane or
gas lanterns after an earthquake. Have flashlights on hand. Stash lot's of Cyulume
chemical light sticks around the house. You can even tape one to your gas meter and
one inside your circuit breaker panel.
I'll post some more info on different preparedness topics in the future.
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I'm not able to find an expiration date on a new case of Costco (Kirkland) water ;)
But there is a best by date that is printed toward the bottom of the bottle in white ink. It is two years from the date it was bottled.
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BostonBob,
I agree that a best by date would normally be printed but I just checked another bottle out of the same case and it does not have that statement. There is a couple series of numbers in white but they are not a date :'(
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I just rotate my water bottles from Sparklettes.That way I am never concerned that they will expire. I always try to have two 5 gallon water jugs available just in case of an emergency in addition to the Kirkland water I buy from Costco.
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We keep 2 - 55 gallon plastic drums outside filled with water for emergencies. Once a year the drums are emptied and used to water trees. When refilled we place 1-2 oz of chlorine bleach and then add water.
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We also have a 55 gallon drum outside. We keep a wrench where we can get to it for turning off the gas line.
Last big earthquake, we checked the weekender house next door, discovered a gas leak, and were able to turn it off.
We also keep our motor home stocked and gassed up incase we need to live in it.
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Time to shake this topic a little.
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Okay. How about a little pet prep.
Do you have a container for your pet/s? One for each pet. Not just small enough to take to the vet, but one with a little room for the pet to move around?
Shelters do not accept pets! You may have to manage your animals for a few days on your own, then they may have to go a friends home or a pet shelter. Take advantage of the opportunity at Wildfire/Disaster Awareness day to have your pet "chipped". They inject a tiny little RFID chip under your pets skin and all shelters can read the chip and return your pet to you if you're separated.
Have your pets carrier ready with a blanket and a water and food bowl, any pet medications they may need, even if your pet dos not normally need tranquilizers, having some in the pet disaster box could be a good idea. Trying to manage a stressed out, frightened animal when you're stressed out and frightened is just one more issue to deal with. And obviously have a rotated back stock of pet food.
And of course WATER! When you are planning water for the family, don't forget to increase the amount enough to water your pets. You may find that a large dog, in summer, drinks more than you do in a day!
If you have horses you should have a spare halter for each horse with a brass tag attached to the halter, with your name and address and cell phone number stamped in it. And this should hang on the stall gate.
If a fire is approaching rapidly and they must be let out they can be identified.
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Wrightwood posted this in another topic:
5.25 gallons of water per person - per day is needed for basic needs.
That's 73 gallons per person for 14 days.
During a major quake the water service in this community will be completely down for an extended period of time. What water might be available will be needed for fire fighting due to the number of anticipated structure fires.
Every household should be properly storing enough water for at least 7-10 days. You can get by with a shortage of food but you can't fake your way through a shortage of water.
When I first read this, I was wondering how the heck you can store that much water! I was thinking the water heater at first, but that's only a drop in the bucket at 40 gallons. I noticed the 55 gallon drum idea above. Where can you get those? I'm concerned that in a quake, the 55 gallon drums will start rolling! Also, could the drums get ruptured during a quake?
I assume the scenario is that all access in and out of town is cut off and we have to survive on our own without outside assistance?
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Does that 5.25 gallons of water include water for washing?
We keep a big bottle of purell in our kit and baby wipes to cut down on the need for water to wash with. Everything else seems easy...but the water..you need a ton of water.
You can buy nice water jugs (I have a 4 gal and 7 gal) at camping stores. They come with a cap that can be reversed for a spigot. I think they run between $10-15. The 55 gal jugs also run about $15 if you buy them used, but you need to be careful what was stored in them originally.
When (if) the water truck comes by you will be happy to have a jug you can carry to the truck. So even if you have barrels, you want to have something portable.
~ali
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ali,
The minimum for basic short time needs is 1 gallon per person, per day.
5 gallons per person, per day allows enough for drinking, cooking and washing.
A good visualization is to look at a 1 gallon container of water and consider living off it for 24 hours.
How much of that gallon of water would be used for drinking if you were physically active during the emergency?
(http://www.tulpehockenwater.com/images/products/gallon_big.jpg)
Then consider a 5 gallon container of water per person, per day.
(http://images.buzzillions.com/images_products/00/52/coleman_5_gallon_water_carrier_reviews_480172_300.jpg)
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Where can containers such as the blue one pictured above, be purchased?
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Boston Bob has this special Indian blend. He told me that you won't need as much if you have this. I guess he plans to be drunk during emergencies!
(http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d180/chuck3195/WHITELIGHTNING.jpg)
;D
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Sport Chalet - Rancho
REI - Rancho
Sports Authority - Rancho
Bass Pro Shops - Victoria Gardens
M&I Surplus - Pomona
Many if not most, disaster preparedness lists (including FEMA and Cal OES) propose 1 gallon per person per day for drinking only. Do you drink that much a day now?
We go camping in the desert with two people for two or three days, and consume less than five gallons total and that's drinking, cooking, washing dishes and washing people. No pets along though.
If you are planning on freeze dried food for your disaster kit you need more water. If you are planning on cold canned meat and fruit with juice you can drink you need less. If you have
pre-moistened field towels for hygiene you can have less. There is not a one solution fits all answer.
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We also have a Sportsman's warehouse next to Costco in Victorville that carries those water jugs as well as other camping stuff.
I remember a recent disaster situation where people were trying to take soda bottles and milk jugs to the trucks to be filled and you really need something with a wider mouth than that for refilling - I have a lot of water in well washed gallon juice (and tea) jugs also - they are wide mouthed and pretty sturdy.
Another goodie - a company called eton (link : http://www.etoncorp.com/GeneralMenu (http://www.etoncorp.com/GeneralMenu)) also puts out a little hand crank radio, with a flashlight on it and a cell phone charger (you need to mail in for the cell phone charger and they send the one that works for your phone). They sell a couple of models at Target.
It really is a good time to go through and replenish the earthquake kit!
~ali
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Its time to get your calculators out and figure out how much SPACE it would take to store 5 gal of water for a family of 4 for 2 weeks. Please answer not in cubic feet but in linear feet.
_ feet x _ feet x _ feet.
What I see is about a half a single car garage full of water that could not stacked because of the weight of the water crushing the cannisters below it. Now multiply that by several thousand people (those below will be coming up). We might consider ourselves lucky if there is snow on the ground when it happens. Realistically, I cant see it being possible to store that much water for 2 weeks. Three to five days is might be much more manageable but is it enough?
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As Clint pointed out there is not a one solution to fit all.
Personally I would rather have enough to take care of our personal needs without skimping and help a few neighbors/friends if needed. I just don't see 1 gal per person, per day accomplishing that while others may think that's just fine. It should also be noted that these numbers are assuming that all water containers remain undamaged or no spillage.
Leftfield if indeed you wanted to store 5 gals per person, per day for 14 days it would take 5 - 55 gallon drums.
The space required would be: 2ft wide x 10ft long x 35" high
(55 gal drum = 34-3/4" tall by 23-1/4" in diameter)
For your family of 4:
1 gallon per person, per day for 14 days = 56 gals
Most disaster preparedness websites also recommend storing enough food and water for 3 days. This is not considered long enough by experts for the conditions anticipated in the Swarthout Valley after a major earthquake. This valley will be isolated for an extended period of time due to its remote location and small population.
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For those of us who dont have garages, storing 5 drums of water may pose quite an undertaking. First, where can someone get plastic drums and hand pump (since there wont be any electricity for a while)?
Those of us that do have garages, may find that the garage may have collapse or the drums themselves tipping over since they arent strapped down. (I can see it now....dozens of heavy 200lbs drums rolling down Pine because they werent or cant be strapped down. :o We do strap down the water heater which is about the same size.)
Please dont get me wrong...we should prepare but some things though easily said, need some thoughts.
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I have 3 55-gallon drums that are strapped together, thus more likely not to roll away.
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We have our drums outside and chained to the outside wall of the house. (out of direct sunlight)
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If you want water drums, pumps, purification tablets, etc., I suggest M&I surplus on Gary Avenue in the most lovely and peaceful community of Pomona. They have all kinds of goodies.
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For those of us who dont have garages, storing 5 drums of water may pose quite an undertaking. First, where can someone get plastic drums and hand pump (since there wont be any electricity for a while)?
Those of us that do have garages, may find that the garage may have collapse or the drums themselves tipping over since they arent strapped down. (I can see it now....dozens of heavy 200lbs drums rolling down Pine because they werent or cant be strapped down. :o We do strap down the water heater which is about the same size.)
Please dont get me wrong...we should prepare but some things though easily said, need some thoughts.
I have to agree - I can see a lot of other potential problems with storing drums of water - freezing in the winter, contaminated water when you happen to open the drum, etc.
As crazy as it sounds, if we really need to plan to be isolated for a couple of weeks in the event of a major disaster, I wonder if a big storage tank for the town would be more effective than every household having one or more 55 gal drums?
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We have stored 55 & 30 gallon drums of water outdoors for more than 10 years in Wrightwood. The drums are drained and refilled each spring with the appropriate amount of bleach added. When the water is dumped it has always been as fresh as the day it was filled.
I don't understand the problems you are anticipating.
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I've had problems with bugs growing in stored water before - but perhaps I didn't have enough bleach. Have you ever tasted the water you stored before watering the trees? Have you checked to see if the water in the drums freezes during the winter? Are you sure that drums sitting outside aren't at risk from being punctured during a quake? Furthermore, I'm not up in town full time, so I'd have to wonder whether someone has tampered with a drum sitting outside.
I'm tempted to just stick with the 40 gallons in the water heater plus several boxes of plastic water jugs from Costco. Having water spread out in several smaller storage containers seems like less of a risk to me compared to having all of my eggs in one basket with one or two big drums.
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"As crazy as it sounds, if we really need to plan to be isolated for a couple of weeks in the event of a major disaster, I wonder if a big storage tank for the town would be more effective than every household having one or more 55 gal drums?"
Uh, where do you think your water comes from now? There are multiple "big storage tanks" all around the community. The problem is that if a quake damages the pipes, many of which are quite old, the delivery system will fail. You can't just store water in a tank indefinitely. It has to be cycled through to stay fresh. Further, the PUC regulates water storage. The water company has wanted to increase our storage capacity for some time but the PUC says what we have is adequate for the community and won't permit expansion of the current storage.
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And Desert 5150, I couldn't agree more about M&I Surplus. One of my favorite stores.
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Here is a good source for water barrels, pumps, purification, etc.
http://www.disastersurvivalskills.com/Foodandwater.html
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A warning against shaky preparations
Article Launched: 07/30/2008 11:00:11 PM PDT
Well, most of us needed the reminder.
And Tuesday's magnitude-5.4 earthquake centered in Chino Hills was almost ideal to jog our memories that we live in quake country, subject to shaking at any moment. There was no loss of life, just a few minor injuries and not much property damage.
Luckily, Chino Hills is a relatively new community, incorporated in 1991, that enjoyed explosive growth in the late '90s and earlier this decade. That means most of its buildings went up under the 1997 building code update that followed the killer 6.7 Northridge quake of 1994.
But Tuesday's shaker was an attention-getter. Now we need that attention to translate into action. We'd suggest that this Saturday - while the memory is fresh - would be a great day to bring all your quake supplies and family contingency plans back up to snuff if they've turned a bit musty.
We admit we've let our own readiness slip a bit, and we bet you have too. We haven't had much in the way of quakes since the first half of the '90s - when besides Northridge there were quakes north of Upland and near Landers and Big Bear.
Of course, the catastrophic quake in China should have spurred us to get ready. So should have the May warning from geologists that a huge quake like the one in China will hit us one day, and that we're not really up to it on individual or governmental levels.
But actually getting shaken up is a more visceral reminder.
Government agencies were already planning a massive drill in November - called the "Great Southern California ShakeOut" - designed to prepare for a 7.8 quake on the San Andreas Fault that scientists say would shake for three minutes and result in 1,800 deaths.
So Saturday would be good time to get prepared for the Big One we're told is inevitable. What does that involve?
Water is the thing you just can't do without. You need to store enough at home to get your family through three days at least, preferably seven, in case your water supply gets severed. Same for food: seven days worth of canned goods and packaged foods that would be easy to prepare or could be eaten right out of the container. You'll need to rotate the stored water and food so it's still good when you need it.
Don't forget the family vehicles, which should carry a handipack of water, some food and comfortable shoes.
Draw up or update an emergency plan for your family. Choose a place to meet if you can't communicate by phone or text. (Cell phone networks and even some land lines were overwhelmed by the huge spike in calls after Tuesday's temblor; the Big One would cause much worse problems.) And everyone in the family should carry an out-of-state contact number to call so you can all report in.
Tend to the house, too. You need a turn-off wrench for your gas meter or an automatic shutoff valve. Secure bookcases and all heavy, tall furniture. Safety latches on cabinets are a good idea. It's all coming back to you, right?
Do it now, before the memory of the Chino Hills quake fades.
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Biking Brian mentioned something that is very good to remember:
Your water heater. Most homes already have 40 to 50 gallons of fresh water stored all the time. Even more if you include toilet tanks. Tanks not bowels folks! The tank holds several gallons of fresh water.
But...
You have to have a way to get at that water in the water heater. If the water supply pressure is interrupted the only way to drain water from your water heater is through the clean out drain at the bottom of the tank. Anyone try to get water out of there lately? These drains are frequently ignored and stuck or clogged. If you drain off a few gallons once a month you will keep the valve operable and improve the life of your water heater. Now how about that toilet tank water. There is between two and five gallons in a conventional toilet tank. But DO NOT put a toilet bowel cleaner in the tank. Blue water is not potable water.
How about another emergency water source? Swarthout Creek, Sheep Creek, Heath Creek. Purchase a hand pump water filter from a sporting goods store. I happen to prefer the MSR brand but they all do a good job. These little filters have been used by backpackers and foreign travelers for years. They remove all the nasty little bugs that can make you sick.
So being disaster prepared does not mean you have to invest in several 55 gallon drums. Be resourceful.
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I wonder if a big storage tank for the town would be more effective than every household having one or more 55 gal drums?
Well the problem with "a storage tank" would be the same as for storing drums of water. It would be best a) to have not just one big tank but 2-3 smaller tanks in the event one or become inaccessable or damaged. b) to have these tanks above ground eliminate the need for a pump but they will most likely be toppled in a major earthquake. Therefore IMHO, they really need to be buried somewhere but a manual pumps need to be attached or easily retrievable from somewhere like the firehouse. c) even with these tanks, we still need to store some water on our own. It certainly would be more convenient since water is really quite dense and heavy.
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I am also partial to the MSR water purifier. I've used it for years backpacking and its pump action makes it very easy to force water through the filter (some are very difficult to use) and it attaches to a standard wide mouth Nalgene bottle.
(http://www.rei.com/zoom/695265_9996Lrg.JPG/150)
As Clint suggested, everyone should invest in one. While bleach or water purification tablets will work, everything I've read said that such chemicals are not really intended for human consumption. I also have never tasted water treated in this way.
Question:
While providing water for hygine and washing, I've read that swimming pool and spa water should never be used for drinking as the chemicals will make you ill. Does anyone know if "distilling" spa water will leave the chemicals out of it? We do not use the typical chemicals like Chlorine or Bromine in our spa. We use Baqua Spa which is much more gentle on the skin. Would distilling water remove such chemicals from the water or unlike salts and minerals, have they bonded with the molecules? Any chemists out there?
As far as the water heater goes, most of them have many inches of sediment in them, effectively blocking the spicket. Something to keep in mind.
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The problem that I see using pool/spa water is the need for electricity to keep the water running through the filtering system. Since the pool/spa is rather quite opened, after a few standing days, it will start to turn cloudy which is indicative of algae and other microbes. I would start "bottling" the water ASAP but to hold that much water, we are back to using the 55 gal drums. Anyway, the first few days, the water should be fine though it wont be very "tasty".
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You are right. The pool/spa would be nothing more than a standing body of water which could quickly become contaminated. I would never use such water without filtering it through the filter mentioned above, boiling it or distilling it.
I raised this question because I've read on several emergency/survial sites that you cannot use pool or spa water for drinking water because the chemicals are harmful. But they didn't say whether you could safely remove the chemicals before drinking the water. Another concern are the carcinogins that are present in Pool water.
"The bad news is that most pool water contains some level of trihalomethanes (THM) - usually in the parts per billion
(ppb)range. These THMs are not allowed in drinking water because they are carcinogenic. One example is chloroform.
There is no regulation on THMs in pool or spa water. Mostly because you are swimming in it and not drinking or ingesting it. Absorbtion is minimal."
"Extrapolating some numbers on cyanuric acid and its dangers - an adult person would have to consume about 4 pounds of pure CYA to have a problem (actually only 50% would have a problem). Four pounds is about how much CYA is in a 15,000-gallon pool. So you would have to drink the whole pool to have a problem."
"So on a temporary or emergency basis, you can drink pool water."
(taken from: http://www.southshoregunitepools.com/resources/pdfs/pool_water_okay.pdf)
So, my concern was more about being able to remove the chemicals from the water and whether the above methods of purifying water would do so, rather than purifying the water from bio-organisms that would be harmful.
I'm begining to believe that the chlorine or other chemicals used in a pool will not present much of a problem after a few days. After all, tap water is usually treated with a chlorine compound, although not in the same concentrations and pets regularly will use the pool for drinking water. If my research is correct the chemicals will either bleed off as a gas through evaporation over a short amount of time or will bond with organic material that can be easily removed through the use of a filter or distilling it.
Truth be known, if it comes down to running out of good drinking water and having a spa sitting there full to the brim, I'd take whatever filtering measures I could and then just take my chances. I've had "the runs" before. ;D
So my Emergency plan is to have as much drinking water stored to last 14 days and to use the Spa water for cleaning and washing. But if necessary I'd use the spa water for drinking only after filtering, boiling or distilling it.
If anybody has come up with some different research about the harmful effects of using pool or spa water for drinking or has information showing that I'm heading down the wrong road with this thinking, I'd like to hear it.
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Instead of counting on the spa for drinking, get a fire pump and use it to help extinguish the fires that will follow a major earthquake.
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Instead of counting on the spa for drinking, get a fire pump and use it to help extinguish the fires that will follow a major earthquake.
Roger!
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That would work if the pool or spa still contains water. After a mojor EQ >=7.2 there won't be much water left in most pools. The plumbing will probably crack and drain the water out or the pool will pop out of the ground some distance. Spas, if covered, will keep most of their water. Otherwise, no water.....
Some will survive and be usable. Depends on the whim or nature.
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In retrospect, I doubt there will be a study on the safety on drinking pool/spa water because each pool/spa will be maintained according to its owner's whim. Some will save a nickle by not putting in the necessary amount of chemicals and others will put in "extra" to be on the "safe" side. Since we have a lot of weekenders, I can easily see some spas not being maintained regularly.
If I had a spa that Ive been maintaining regularly and properly, I would "experiment" to see if pH and whatever else is in the proper range then drink a small amount of water now and see if I suffer any ill effects. If all is well, then I will know that in the future, I have a temporary source of drinking water. Keep in mind that toxic effect of chemicals are dependent on concentration and time of exposure. To me, its like cigarettes. Youre more likely to get cancer if you smoke for a number of years at a high volume. Your chance of getting cancer would be negligible if you smoke just cigars just twice a year.
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I have three 55-gallon jugs of water - but how am I going to get the water out?
I have a ham radio, but I keep it plugged in in the upstairs bathroom. What if I can't get to it?
I had food stored - but the emergency food is gone (this economy is kicking my a$$!). I saw a container at Costco that contained 200 meals for $69. When I can, I'm going to buy it. I have a feeling that food won't tempt me in a non-emergency situation.
I have my CERT bag, but where do I keep it? By the door? By the ham radio? What if my house collapses? Where's the best place? The car?
I'm trying to be prepared, but I have a long way to go.
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Well, I've learned which native plants and things (insects :o ) to eat, and how to prepare them, and where the springs are in the area. And I know how to grow food. I think I can live without a market.
Maybe we need to get back to basic living.
In any case, we will need each other in the event of catastrophy. We have a lot more brain as a group than as individuals. :)
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I have three 55-gallon jugs of water - but how am I going to get the water out?
Hand pump. Siphon. Ice pick. In that order.
I have a ham radio, but I keep it plugged in in the upstairs bathroom. What if I can't get to it?
Put it where you can get to it.
I had food stored - but the emergency food is gone (this economy is kicking my a$$!). I saw a container at Costco that contained 200 meals for $69. When I can, I'm going to buy it. I have a feeling that food won't tempt me in a non-emergency situation.
I have my CERT bag, but where do I keep it? By the door? By the ham radio? What if my house collapses? Where's the best place? The car?
Yes. In the car is good. In a heavy locker near a sturdy corner of the house. Or under a large window so if the wall fails it's easier to dig out.
I'm trying to be prepared, but I have a long way to go.
A good way to go is a portable shed outside if you can protect it from overheating and freezing. The car has the same issues. I've had water bottles freeze in the car in winter.
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"As crazy as it sounds, if we really need to plan to be isolated for a couple of weeks in the event of a major disaster, I wonder if a big storage tank for the town would be more effective than every household having one or more 55 gal drums?"
Uh, where do you think your water comes from now? There are multiple "big storage tanks" all around the community. The problem is that if a quake damages the pipes, many of which are quite old, the delivery system will fail. You can't just store water in a tank indefinitely. It has to be cycled through to stay fresh. Further, the PUC regulates water storage. The water company has wanted to increase our storage capacity for some time but the PUC says what we have is adequate for the community and won't permit expansion of the current storage.
Just finally getting around to reading replies a month later! Of course I knew that water comes from storage tanks in town, what I was thinking was an additional amount of storage added to this system (and not sitting stagnant), equivalent to the number of households times the number of gallons recommended for each. Sure, the delivery system may (will?) fail but I assume the valves to the distribution system would then be closed to save the water. If that happens, I hope there's a plan to use the tank contents to fill smaller containers and send it where needed. Anyway, a moot point due to Clint's PUC comment above.
On another note, I was looking at using the Costco boxes with 6 one gallon jugs, and I noticed this article that says "Most grocery stores sell water in one or two gallon containers. These are not designed for long-term storage and will leak after six months." Is this true of the Costco bottles, I've had no problems with mine in an unheated and uninsulated garage.
http://www.mygreathome.com/safety/earthquake_preparedness/water.htm
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After reading all of the posts regarding earthquakes, I decided to look at sites about earthquakes and found this particular piece of "info". It can be found at www.quakeprediction.com. Any opinions?
Earthquakes likely to occur in
Los Angeles risk of 5.8+
December 16 = 89%
December 15 = 89%
December 14 = 87%
Los Angeles risk of 6.3+
December 13 = 87%
December 12 = 90%
December 11 = 95%
San Francisco risk of 4.9
December 16 = 95%
December 15 = 92%
December 14 = 89%
San Francisco risk of 4.4
December 13 = 85%
December 12 = 85%
December 11 = 88%
Earthquake Prediction Video CBS13 Earthquake Interview
Earthquake Finder Earthquake Research
Los Angeles Earthquake Prediction San Francisco Quake Prediction
The Great American Shakeout Totally Free Dating Site
Metaphor and Simile Examples Free Career Test
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If you predict an earthquake each and every day, sooner or later you're bound to be right. When you look at their methods for making predictions, you will see that they are using mostly legions and folklore.
You would be better served to be prepared for "the big one" and then not worry about it.
I am not associated with the USGS.
I do not work with the USGS.
# Quakeprediction.com We use many methods to come up with our final forecast. Here are a few listed below; Moon phases
# Animal behaviour
# Human behaviour
# Micro earthquakes
# Seismic gaps
# Thermal temperature changes
# Satellite earthquake clouds
# ULF or Ultra Low Frequency sounds
# Water temperature changes
# Steam emissions
# Magnetic field changes
# Radon gas release
# Well water changes
# Animals can detect the P-wave or ultrasonic wave generated by a big underground explosion or the rupture of an earthquake, even if the waves are too small for humans' senses. These waves travel faster than the S-wave earthquake wave that most strongly shakes the ground and causes the most damage. When this happens, animals can detect the incoming earthquake wave, and start behaving agitatedly or nervously, the same way a human would behave if they heard a loud explosion right outside their house.
# Some people believe that in this way animals sense the immediate onset of earthquakes. In support of this claim, instances are cited when people have witnessed flight of animals just before an earthquake disaster. In fact, according to the Chief conservator of forests for Tamilnadu, a few minutes before the killer tsunami waves generated by an underwater earthquake hit the Indian coastline in December 2004, a 500-strong herd of blackbucks rushed away from the coastal areas to the safety of a nearby hilltop. Since the beginning of recorded history, observations of unusual animal behavior before earthquakes have been recorded by people from almost all civilizations. The Chinese began a systematic study of this unusual animal behavior and in December 1974 predicted a major earthquake that did, in fact, occur in February 1975. But skeptics claim to debunk nearly all such observations. In fact, the 1975 prediction relied most heavily on a series of strong foreshocks. The animal behavior reports are often ambiguous and not consistently observed. There is little evidence for animals being able to sense impending earthquakes, although it is likely they can sense the initial, weaker P-waves before people. Seismometers remain much more sensitive than even the animals, however.
# In folklore, some animals have had more reports of being able to predict quakes than others. Likely: Dogs, cats, chickens and other smaller animals. There have been reports with elephants, too. Unlikely: Goats, horses, cows, and larger animals.
# Japan has a long tradition associating catfish with earthquake prediction. From this idea emerged a long university research programme concluding in 2004 in which it was proposed that the (established) high sensitivity of catfish to electric fields was involved in detecting fields of a few hertz because of piezoelectric effects on deeply buried quartz crystals. Actual monitoring of catfish and correlation with earthquakes gave results that are not promising.
# Source of data At Quakeprediction.com we have also found that animal behaviour is very important when working with earthquake prediction. This is not the only tool we use when making our forecasts, but it is a vital part of our earthquake forecasting model.
# Quakeprediction.com was officially opened online at 4:15pm - May 24th 2006, 100 years after the April 18th 1906 earthquake in San Francisco.
http://www.quakeprediction.com/Earthquake%20Research.html
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I have a 55 gallon barrel for water along with other backup containers but wanted additional water storage...I found this company from a friend and ordered. They assure my that it's fine in heat and cold, but that the containers should be out of the sun or covered. They seem to be the solution I was looking for and the watersafes come with a siphon and hose attached. The price for the large watersafe seemed reasonable to me.
I also bought the chlorine dioxide to purify water.
http://www.mywatersafe.com/
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I was talking with the folks who had the water storage drums on display this weekend, and it was mentioned that they wanted to get about 5,000 of those 55 gallon drums out in the community.
<rant on> I still stand by my earlier statements that if that much water is really needed, then the real issue is we need more storage as part of the town water system. But since the reality is that the powers that be aren't going to provide more storage, I agree that getting as many drums out into the community is a good thing. <rant off>
Anyway, now I'm working on the practical issue of where to put the drum. I don't really want to put it next to the house or in/next to the garage.
The shed is a possibility. The shed floor is made of 2x4s which sit on a few 4x6s which are anchored to concrete pier blocks. If I put the drum on a part of the shed floor that's above a 4x6 it should support the weight. But I have no idea how deep the piers are buried, so I don't know how the shed would do in an earthquake.
So my latest thinking is to keep it away from structures, perhaps next to a tree, in a small plastic shed or other enclosure to protect it from damage and sunlight. (That has the other advantage that I can put the drum near the highest part of the property, which will make it easier to use the old water for plants and trees when it's time to refill the drum.) Lowes has a Rubbermaid Vertical Storage Shed which looked promising, but it wasn't quite deep enough for a drum. Of course I could go with a bigger shed, but then the cost goes up too. I've thought of making walls and a roof out of plywood, letting the drum sit on the dirt, and securing it all to a tree. Any other ideas?
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<rant on> I still stand by my earlier statements that if that much water is really needed, then the real issue is we need more storage as part of the town water system. But since the reality is that the powers that be aren't going to provide more storage, I agree that getting as many drums out into the community is a good thing. <rant off>
In a major event, its possible that water mains could be broken, pumps might not be able to be operated, or the tanks themselves could be damaged. If that happens, it doesn't matter how much storage capacity the water company has, if they can't deliver the water to our homes. In my opinion, that's the reason to have your own personal supply.
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Just remember water is 8.34lbs per gal. 55gals is 459lbs so you need to spread that weight out in a storage shed
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In a major event, its possible that water mains could be broken, pumps might not be able to be operated, or the tanks themselves could be damaged. If that happens, it doesn't matter how much storage capacity the water company has, if they can't deliver the water to our homes. In my opinion, that's the reason to have your own personal supply.
Good points, although I wasn't thinking that more water storage would eliminate the need to have a personal supply, but perhaps reduce the amount that each household needs to keep. I was thinking that we could drive to the tank and fill containers if the delivery system was broken, but perhaps it might not be possible to cross the washes to get to the tank. Ok, sorry to be a stick in the mud on this! ;D
Anyway, I'm thinking of making my own enclosure with cement blocks to keep the drum off the ground, plywood walls/roof, and strap/bolt it all to a big tree so that it's not going anywhere.
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Elephant's foot buckle is something that takes place to large storage tanks during earthquakes.
http://www.smate.wwu.edu/teched/geology/eq-CA-Landers.html
http://www.johnmartin.com/earthquakes/eqshow/lan_0004.htm
Pipes don't stand much of a chance either.
http://libraryphoto.cr.usgs.gov/cgi-bin/show_picture.cgi?ID=ID.%20Kachadoorian,%20R.%20274ct