Snow players invade Wrightwood

[Wrightwood]

If the signs/banners or porta potties are put along Hwy 2 on the Caltrans right of way they will require permits.

[daf]

Anything in the CalTrans right of way requires a permit and to get that permit you will have to have insurance to cover CalTrans if there are any claims

[tcaarabians]

Hmmm. Do the 'astericks' on the poles require permits?   If so, bummer. If not... smallish signs under them .. so the message scrolls out a bit as you rot there in traffic might work.  Just thinking off the top of my head here.. with very little knowledge as to what is possible. cheryl o7o

[Wrightwood]

[Elk]

Multiple injuries for what I assume are snowplayers...
From ANF Dispatch website:
01/17/2016 14:40 ANF-229  head injury Medical Aid apple tree campground .  ENG-37 PAT-38 . . . 34,23.142 x 117,42.714

01/17/2016 14:31 ANF-228  head injury Medical Aid big pines ranger station . . . . . 34,22.584 x 117,41.046

[lynnc]

And tomorrow is a holiday.......

[ForestGal]

Well, I don't know if it's appropriate to post this, but I had a very nice experience with some snow players this afternoon, and the whole thing just made me feel extra blessed.  I live in a quiet neighborhood near the Community Garden, and while I was walking my dog, about 1/2 block from my house, a car with a young family in it stopped by me and asked if there was a place they could go to play in the snow that "wasn't in a residential area".  That's exactly what the young mom said.  Since they were so polite, I directed them to the lot across the street from me (I know the owners, they are super nice and are never here), and I knew everything would be OK. They thanked me, went and parked by the vacant lot and proceeded to have a blast. I went out to sweep up some leaves, and saw they were taking pics so I walked over and asked if they would like me to take a pic of all of them.  I got to chatting with the mom, they live in Palmdale and the 6 year old daughter had never been in the snow.  They were just having so much fun.  The only traces they left were footprints in the snow, and some thrown snowballs in the street.  Why can't all our visitors be this pleasant and polite? 

[jek134]

Just wondering if anyone (in leadership) has contacted CR&R or maybe a larger trash company to see what services they offer and at what cost to clean up loads of trash left by visitors. Maybe someone out there has a program for our type of community/situation. I think maybe one problem might be that the visitors are playing and littering in areas they aren't supposed to be so there are no trash receptacles for them to place their broken sleds and dirty diapers. I don't know the laws for that, and maybe placing trash receptacles in those areas would encourage them to stop and play in those areas, but the alternative is having the trash out there. I also don't know where the trash receptacles would be placed since it's usually uneven territory where the snow players are, but maybe a large trash company has experience with this. I'm sure there's a way to apply for a grant somewhere...

[Phyto Guy]

Not every snow player is good or bad, honorable or not, ethical or... etc.. However many people that don't have the inner strength to just do the right thing, regardless of the influences around them, sometimes behave poorly. I don't believe that all litter can be prevented . However some appropriate signage at places where the snow players go could significantly help. A few signs at ingress and egress of our town could help the folks on the fence decide to be better citizens. Signage that's positive like "Wrightwood- help keep it clean". I use to give trash bags to folks on the Azusa side of the mountains. Even if families were camping with trash everywhere, when given a trash bag, they inevitably sent the kids out to collect trash. Hand out trash bags to people that say "Keep Our Mountains Beautiful". Folks will generally do the right thing given the responsibility, dignity, opportunity and device to do it. I don't believe that this sort of thing will cure the problem. This is not a cure but a reasonable approach to an ongoing problem.

[Nolena]

Mountain Hardware hands out free trash bags, maps of snow play areas, and they provide a lot of porta-potties, all at their own expense.
 
It would be nice to have maps of snow play areas to hand out to those snow playing in the wrong spots.
"I'm sorry, this is not a snow play area. But here's a map of areas that are open to snow play, with a restroom guide."
(I would even hand out cookies for maximum impact.)

[thehallmarks]

Aren't there laws and fines against littering along the freeways and state Roads?  Perhaps CalTrans could be convinced to put up several signs along Hwy 2 and the County along Lone Pine Cyn Road!

[SkierBob]

yes, there are also laws against abandoning animals and driving over the posted speed limit 

and people still do both

We don't need more laws we need less people

[walter k]

I hate to think some niebor would send snowplayers to play in my yard because they seemed nice. 

[ForestGal]

I hate to think some niebor would send snowplayers to play in my yard because they seemed nice. 

That lot is no one's "yard".  It's a vacant lot.  I would never send anyone into someone's yard. 

[jek134]

These are all great suggestions - handing out trash bags, asking CalTrans to post signs on their portable billboards, even the cookies!  What's the next step? I don't think Mountain Hardware should shoulder all of the cost or responsibility.

[thehallmarks]

I'm not suggesting more laws just putting the notification that these laws exist where they are most flagrantly violated--and therefore needed....

[Wrightwood]

asking CalTrans to post signs on their portable billboards

You can cross that idea off the list as Terri Kasinga from Caltrans stated at the Nov 2015 Winter Traffic Meeting that they Will Not and Do Not provide that service. It was suggested by Caltrans (Terri Kasinga) that the community rent portable message signs and apply for permits to use them. Renting 2 signs for 4 months was quoted at $8,289 plus Caltrans permits are required for each sign and all messages must be approved.

[thehallmarks]

Forest Falls came up with a good idea!

Today every pass they sell comes with a free trash bag!

[tcaarabians]

I appreciate the positive experiences that a few people in this thread have posted. That does not mean I don't appreciate those messages that focus more on the problem and suggestions for solutions.

From the pictures that have been posted, it seems to me at least, that more trash cans and dumpsters are needed. In those pics it does appear that people are trying to use overflowing trash cans.

The Forest Service has an iconic image in Smokey Bear.  Adults recognize it. Kids recognize it. What if the F.S. had a Smokey image on the trash cans/dumpsters with just the words "Thank You for keeping the forest clean" .. in English and Spanish?   That would also work on banners or signs.  We might as well face the fact that there will always be people that are slobs.  But, a heck of a lot of people do want to do the right thing. That needs to be reinforced.

I also toy with the idea of signs that state:  "Caution! Bears chase people that litter."  There's probably a liability issue there as well.  cheryl o7o

[jek134]

I love that a free trash bag is handed out with a Forest pass. I actually had two separate parties pull up to my driveway while I was shoveling the ice off and ask where they could buy a pass on Saturday. I'm glad they're being tougher on requiring those because in the past it seems they've been pretty relaxed. I buy the annual pass every year, but I never see any other cars displaying one. I like that the forest service is actually looking for them. Does anyone know if it's legal for me to display a banner on my fence? Our house is on Hwy 2 and the traffic stops right in front. The price for the sign rentals and permits is ridiculous! That lady at CalTrans must know how ridiculous that is for a small community to spend resources like that. Eyeroll.