FRS & GMRS Radios

[RobertW]

Good job by Jim handling the net. 

I thought I'd make a comment about the issue with the FRS radios that Ken brought up.  As you mentioned John, it is true that the radios you buy with 4 or 5 watts are your GMRS radios as I believe there is a 1 or 2 watt restriction for the FRS band.  But those radios are still considered FRS radios which also have the added channels and GMRS band frequencies.  On those radios only the GMRS channels and frequencies have the capability of the higher power and you are only required to be licensed when using those extra GMRS channels.  The radios also have the FRS band frequencies and as long as you only transmit on the FRS frequencies (despite the fact that the radio is a GMRS radio also) you don't need a license.  In other words, you don't need a license to have the radio with GMRS capability.  You only need the license if you are going to transmit on the GMRS channels on your FRS radio.

As you stated MOST people don't get the license because of the $85 expense.  But MOST people don't know which channels on their FRS radios are the GMRS channels that require a license.

Just knowing who has FRS radios in the neighborhood isn't going to help much in an emergency as everyone will be on a different channel.  Are there plans to designate a specific channel "without" Privacy turned on that would be used on FRS radios in an event of an emergency and get that information out to our neighbors?

Again, great Net last night.

[Wrightwood]

Bob,
Finding out if neighbors have FRS radios is an exercise with a few goals in mind. Having amateur radio operators talking with neighbors about FRS radios might open a dialog between neighbors on the importance of emergency communications. After all the neighbors may not even know that amateur radio operators live in their neighborhood and probably never considered using juniors FRS radio (stuffed in the closet) in the event of a major disaster.

It has become very standard operating procedure for community disaster preparedness groups to establish neighborhood FRS plans, especially in rural communities such as ours. Mapping and planning of a community FRS plan would include specific channel assignments and has been discussed at disaster preparedness meetings in Wrightwood.

FRS radios are very limited in their range but they are a tool that would help citizens communicate locally after a major disaster and they may already own them.

[RobertW]

I thought I'd post a little more information on the FRS and GMRS Radios:

A standard FRS radio has 14 channels and are limited to 0.5 watts.  Channels 1 - 7 are shared with the GMRS Radio Service.  Up to 5 watts is allowed on channels 1 - 7 only with a GMRS license and these frequencies are simplex only.

The higher mileage range FRS radios include all the GMRS Frequencies.  Channels 1 - 14 and Channels 15 - 22 (GMRS only, license required)  Channels 15 - 22 are allowed up to 5 watts and are Repeater Frequencies with a 5,000 MHz step up.  (i.e. Channel 15 = output of 462.5500 MHz, input of 467.5500 MHz)

CH          Freq         Description
1        462.5625     FRS/GMRS
2        462.5875     FRS/GMRS
3        462.6125     FRS/GMRS
4        462.6375     FRS/GMRS
5        462.6625     FRS/GMRS
6        462.6875     FRS/GMRS
7        462.7125     FRS/GMRS
8        467.5625     FRS
9        467.5825     FRS
10      467.6125     FRS
11      467.6375     FRS
12      467.6625     FRS
13      467.6875     FRS
14      467.7125     FRS
15      462.5500     GMRS
16      462.5750     GMRS
17      462.6000     GMRS
18      462.6250     GMRS
19      462.6500     GMRS
20      462.6750     GMRS
21      462.7000     GMRS
22      462.7250     GMRS

The CTCSS frequencies used by Motorola are different from those used by RadioShack.

Tone/RadioShack/MotorolaSport/MotorolaTalkAbout
67.0              1                                            1
69.4              2      
71.9              3                                            2
74.4              4                                            3
77.0              5                     A                     4
79.7              6                                            5
82.5              7                                            6
85.4              8                                            7
88.5              9                     B                     8
91.5            10                                            9
94.8            11                                          10
97.4            12                    C                    11
100.0          13                                          12
103.5          14                                          13
107.2          15                    D                    14
110.9          16                                          15
114.8          17                                          16
118.8          18                    E                    17
123.0          19                                          18
127.3          20                    F                    19
131.8          21                                          20
136.5          22                   G                     21
141.3          23                                          22
146.2          24                                          23
151.4          25                                          24
156.7          26                                          25
159.8          27      
162.2          28                                          26
165.5          29      
167.9          30                                          27
171.3          31      
173.8          32                                          28
177.3          33      
179.9          34                                          29
183.5          35      
186.2          36                                          30
189.9          37      
192.8          38                                          31
203.5                                                        32
210.7                                                        33
218.1                                                        34
225.7                                                        35
233.6                                                        36
241.8                                                        37
250.3                                                        38

[RennMan]

I dug out our two FRS radios made by Bell (given to me as a Father's Day present years ago).  Since the channels are listed as 1-7, and not by frequency, I'd have to communicate with someone who had a 400 Mhz amateur radio to see which frequencies these radios are actually using.

If I were to pickup another set, it seems that GMRS (or possibly a hybrid FRS/GMRS radio) is the way to go, for the greater range and frequency options.  If I obtain the licence under my name, members of my immediate family can communicate under that same licence.

From Wikipedia:
"The General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS) is a land-mobile UHF radio service in the United States available for short-distance two-way communications to facilitate the activities of an adult individual who possesses a valid GMRS license, as well his or her immediate family members, including a spouse, children, parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, nephews, nieces, and in-laws (47 CFR 95.179). Immediate relatives of the GMRS system licensee are entitled to communicate among themselves over the general area of their residence or during recreational group outings, such as camping or hiking."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Mobile_Radio_Service

The more I learn, the more I realize I don't know...

[clint]

RennMan,


I have a frequency counter. We can connect and I can tell you what your transmit freqs are.

KB6CLA

[BikingBrian]

Any recommendations for a ~5 watt GMRS radio that will work with repeaters? It's for use down the hill with a repeater on Saddleback or Mt. Wilson.

[Chuck]

CERT has used FRS radios extensively for our drills and activations.  FRS requires no license while 5 watt GMRS does.  Costco did sell a very nice set for about $50 but doesn't offer it at the stores now.  They do offer a threesome set on line (and others) but I'm not sure if it's the same quality as the ones offered in the stores.  Several are water proof or resistent.

Mr. Wrightwood did a recent study on the radios and my understanding is the ones with double A batteries (rechargeable ones) were a lot better (AAA not lasting long).  Hopefully he will chime in on this question.  I think you get a lot more for spending $50 instead of the lesser expensive $25 set. 

[Tibia]

BikingBrian

New, repeater capable GMRS radios are getting harder and harder to find.   Most of us are using older commercial and public safety radios that are Part 95A type accepted.   Note.. not all commercial & public service radios have the Part 95A type acceptance, so one needs to check first before investing in one.   My GMRS HT is a Kenwood TK-370G which went for the mid $300s when purchased used years ago.

Bob

[SkierBob]

My GMRS HT is a Kenwood TK-370G which went for the mid $300s when purchased used years ago.

That would have been the TK-370GK 450 to 470 mhz 4 watt 128 channel w/built in DTMF
Jan 04 list price was $459  I have one sitting here on my desk. 

[Tibia]

That be the one...   

[BikingBrian]

Anyone use these repeater capable GMRS radios?

http://www.amazon.com/Motorola-MR355R-35-Mile-22-Channel-Two-Way/dp/B001UE6MJI

A friend and I with 2 watt bubble pack GMRS radios (not those above) got 5 miles with one of us on a hill and clear line of sight. But then we did a similar test 10 miles apart and got nothing. So my concern is that the bubble pack radios aren't going to be powerful enough to reach the repeater.  Too bad, because it would be nice to be able to chat with another one in my bicycling group using the repeater, yet still be able to talk with other friends with bubble pack FRS/GMRS radios.

[Tibia]

Here's a review of the Motorola MR355R ...
   http://www.twowayradioforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=762

Bob
WQCB860 (gmrs)
W6AJO (ham)

[BikingBrian]

I found this thread, interesting since his needs are similar to mine.

http://forums.radioreference.com/gmrs-frs/191892-best-non-bubble-pack-gmrs-radio.html

I'm finding that most of the commercial radios are Part 90 but not Part 95A certified. <sigh> Anyone have an old one they're willing to part with? :-)

[Tibia]

Hopefully you are having great luck in finding the gmrs radios.   
If not, may I suggest you contact a local communications club/group that uses gmrs.

Ones that come to mind are :

CREST Communications   http://www.crestcom.org
So California GMRS Group   http://www.socalgrms.org

Bob

[Tibia]

Opps...   

Correction.   The So California GMRS Group url is http://www.socalgmrs.org

[BikingBrian]

Yeah, figured out the typo, thanks. By the way, I was able to use my bubble pack GMRS radio to listen in on the Monday night net chat on Santiago Peak, which is operated by CREST. They let guests check in, but I did not since my current radio isn't repeater capable.