Congress seeks plan to boost Forest Service vacancies in SoCal

[FSfirefighter]

[All Day, All Night]

Its sad but true. Plenty of my co-workers have used working for the Forest Service as a stepping stone to get where they are today. USFS firefighters get vast experience and training in wildland situations which many agencies in Southern California love to have. Urban interface has become an alarming concern to many of the large city and county fire departments and recruiting firefighters that have worked with CalFire and the USFS is highly sought after. I think the only thing better that a recruit can have other than USFS or CalFire experience is a paramedic cert. The pay scale examples given in these articles is a good understanding as to why USFS firefighters leave, but when you compare those salaries to what you can make in agencies such as the LAFD, Santa Monica FD and LA County FD, its clear to see why the jump is made, and thats not comparing benefits. I know a couple guys that left San Bernadino County FD to come work us.

[tiltronix]

The money would be there if they eliminated some of "the office help!"

[SkierBob]

I don't want to pay for it.   

[Wildman]

The money would be there if they eliminated some of "the office help!"

Neither of you really haven't spent a moment researching this, have you? That is the stock...."I hate any form of government" answer.  Heck, most of the local Forests are shorthanded on "office help".  Are you aware that most of the support functions that help run the major fire efforts comes out of the "office help" on any forest.  They leave their "regular" office job and go to the Team command post...sleep on the ground for two weeks  to run the finance section or the human resources section, or ground support or logistics.  Just like any combat function....for every crew on the line, there has to be support backing them up. While they are gone, their work just keeps stacking up.

Take a look at the rosters of any of the SoCal forests and you will find that all are short handed on a day to day basis for the jobs (both office and fire).  It's bad enough that Congress doesn't fund the Forest Service as it should be (Yep, your elected officials and representatives in Washington were instrumental in creating this mess) The bottom line is that we are losing valuable field experience and training.....that we already paid for...to other agencies that pay a living wage and benefits.  These Federal Fire folks represent an incredibly valuable resource that combine local knowledge and solid firefighting experience
to confront the new reality of urban interface firefighting.  I want my Federal Firefighters to be able to take care of their families and make a career....right here on our local forests.

[lagomorphmom]

Neither of you really haven't spent a moment researching this, have you? That is the stock...."I hate any form of government" answer.

Ding, ding, ding...And we have a winner.

Ok, that was sarcastic, but I'm fed up on this issue. While your sentiments may be applicable in other areas of the government, the forest service, parks, etc. have all been areas robbed of funding to pay for other, more publicly visible sectors of our economy/infrastructure/government whatever you want to call it. While you may be able put off maintaining your car/house/whatever with a bandaid approach, ultimately you have the option of getting a new one. You cannot steward the forest with that approach.

[SkierBob]

The money would be there if they eliminated some of "the office help!"

Neither of you really haven't spent a moment researching this, have you?

No I haven't.  I'm for cutting spending within all government agencies just as a matter of policy. I know there's only so much money to go around.   I just saw this morning where California is spending 600,000,000 dollars more then they have each month.  So those CDF jobs might not be paying so well in the future. 

When private sector employers are loosing employees to Federal & State agencies pay scales are out of balance.  When you have governmental employees jumping ship from one agency to another for better pay that further shows me how far pay scales are off balance with private employers. Competitive markets set the pay for the private sector, governmental agencies have no competition. So the only way employees get raises is by whining and telling tax paying citizens they are under staffed and won't be able to save them in the event of a fire or emergency unless they get more money.   Government has never spent money as prudently as private business or family households, and often pay more for the same equipment and services, and they want more money? I don't think so. 

I do like the idea of getting rid of USFS office help though.

How about if we abolish the U.S. Postal service and give that money to the USFS?  Western Union killed the telegram without fan fare. The Postal service is as out dated and unneccesary in the electronic information age.  The only thing keeping the post office afloat is the darn junk mail.   

[Wildman]

Bob-The sky is blue.

[love_walnuts]

I do like the idea of getting rid of USFS office help though.

How about if we abolish the U.S. Postal service and give that money to the USFS?  Western Union killed the telegram without fan fare. The Postal service is as out dated and unnecessary in the electronic information age.  The only thing keeping the post office afloat is the darn junk mail.   

Most businesses I know have administration because paperwork needs processed, employees need paychecks, etc. Who would you suggest do the admin for the department? Would the ff'ers do their own?

Also, that "junk mail" allows for the $0.41 postage. Perhaps FedEx, DHL, UPS and the likes could take over, but I don't think the US is ready for the $2 letter.

just my

[mensajanitor]

I'll vote for a tax to increase FF pay every time it comes up. These people are worth every cent they get paid even if all they do is sit at the station and play cards. If they are doing that they won't have to be putting out fires.

[All Day, All Night]

even if all they do is sit at the station and play cards.

Thanks for the vote, but sitting around and playing cards all day is hardly what happens at a station. Maybe after every meal to see who's in the sud's, but thats about it. Drilling, studying, cleaning equipment, 89% of calls EMS. Our station averages 20 calls a day on the squad. Thats going to call, transport to hospital, give report, restock and come back to the station. Remember, theres 24 hour a day. You do the math. Some days you dont get a lot of "card time". The engine goes on about 17 to 18 calls a day. We are gone from our families for 24 hours at a time, not counting overtime that can make that 24 hours extend to 72 to 96 hour straight. What else, school visits, station tour... You get the picture...

Nevertheless, the best job in the world!!!! Its like hitting the lotto!

[kew]

There are certain job where it would be a good thing if all they had to do all day "is sit at the station and play cards,"  because that would mean all is right with the world. Jobs like law enforcement, EMTs, fire fighters, etc.

[SkierBob]

Most businesses I know have administration because paperwork needs processed, employees need paychecks, etc. Who would you suggest do the admin for the department? Would the ff'ers do their own?

They could out source the payroll to Axium

Actually I think all branches of government & private business need a paperwork reduction act of some kind. 

When you do business with a private outfit and you don't like the value you're getting out of your dollar you have the choice of going somewhere else.  When we feel we aren't getting our dollars worth out of government agencies we are at their mercy.  And it seems their response is ' if we had more money....'. 

However today I'm very grateful for the Long Valley Fire Department.  My friend got t-boned crossing 395 at Tom's Place last night. There was a big pile of snow in the center divider making it hard to see North bound 395 traffic.  My friend pulled out in front of someone driving from Bishop to Mammoth and got slammed at 65mph.  Had he been hit on the drivers side it could have been fatal.  Fortunately he's ok,, his truck is totaled. The other driver escaped without any injuries. 

I'll be cutting the fire department some slack for some time