Author Topic: Wildfire News 2020 (Read 488801 times)

Joe Schmoe · « **Reply #240 on:** Sep 10, 20, 11:15:06 PM »

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AIRATT52/history/20200910/1949Z/KSBD/KSBD

One flight of the coordinator plane. That's it. And only one flight of a tanker out of San Bernardino to the other fire in Yucaipa.

Yet super scoopers were on this, lol:
https://signalscv.com/2020/09/brush-fire-shuts-down-southbound-interstate-5/

Joe Schmoe · « **Reply #241 on:** Sep 10, 20, 11:51:06 PM »

Here is the canyon I'm referring to. This is from Angeles Crest Hwy looking south. The fire started at Cogswell dam, which is on the other side of that little perpendicular ridge at the bottom of the canyon.

Facing a little more southwest, I think this is before the tunnels...

TimG · « **Reply #242 on:** Sep 11, 20, 01:45:35 AM »

Maybe it is a choice ... pine forests naturally burn historically every 25 years or so, if it hasn't burned, and burning isn't a threat, then it should.

lwt42 · « **Reply #243 on:** Sep 11, 20, 03:10:58 AM »

Quote from: TimG on Sep 11, 20, 01:45:35 AM

Maybe it is a choice ... pine forests naturally burn historically every 25 years or so, if it hasn't burned, and burning isn't a threat, then it should.

Then there are places like Forest Falls (and Wrightwood) where there are people and homes and etc.

There are fires from San Diego to the Canadian border. They are likely having to pick their battles.

Toolman · « **Reply #244 on:** Sep 11, 20, 01:49:48 PM »

Good briefing on the Bobcat Fire
https://www.facebook.com/angelesnationalforest/videos/417789842528402

Jim Wilkins · « **Reply #245 on:** Sep 11, 20, 01:54:13 PM »

Quote from: Joe Schmoe on Sep 10, 20, 11:15:06 PM

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AIRATT52/history/20200910/1949Z/KSBD/KSBD

One flight of the coordinator plane. That's it. And only one flight of a tanker out of San Bernardino to the other fire in Yucaipa.

Yet super scoopers were on this, lol:
https://signalscv.com/2020/09/brush-fire-shuts-down-southbound-interstate-5/

The other day tankers didn't fly because the inversion made visibility unsafe and under their minimums. Today and going forward it will be based on triaging a resource that is in short supply around the country and putting them where the most is threatened. These aircraft are a national resource and finite. No different then the number of folks and equipment on the ground. It has been a very long summer for all of them.

Wrightwood · « **Reply #246 on:** Sep 11, 20, 05:02:16 PM »

AI6YR
@ai6yrham
#BobcatFire Satellite image from Sentinel-2 showing Crystal Lake sometime yesterday/projected into 3D. You can see the fire up on the ridgeline.

Wrightwood · « **Reply #247 on:** Sep 11, 20, 05:09:03 PM »

http://www.alertwildfire.org/orangecoca/index.html?camera=Axis-Arcadia2&v=81e004f

Wrightwood · « **Reply #248 on:** Sep 11, 20, 06:45:36 PM »

Joe Schmoe · « **Reply #249 on:** Sep 11, 20, 07:00:03 PM »

Quote from: Jim Wilkins on Sep 11, 20, 01:54:13 PM

The other day tankers didn't fly because the inversion made visibility unsafe and under their minimums. Today and going forward it will be based on triaging a resource that is in short supply around the country and putting them where the most is threatened. These aircraft are a national resource and finite. No different then the number of folks and equipment on the ground. It has been a very long summer for all of them.

Thanks Jim. The confusing thing is the contrast between what was a days-long air train coming out of San Bernardino to work the Lake fire, and the lack of aircraft activity on this fire. The inversion layer is practically a constant in the LA basin, but I could see the tops of our 10K-foot peaks during times when the aircraft were parked, so I don't understand how working these fires differs. From my layman's point of view it almost seems like there were a trigger point a few days ago where we gave up on fighting the Bobcat fire and fell back to let it burn up to a very large perimeter.

Also, does the San Gabriel Wilderness designation or the National Monument designation change the fire fighting approach at all? Lastly, I think I recall that the super scoopers are hired by LA County, and this was in LA County land, but I don't think I've ever seen them work in the National Forest. Is that true?

Wrightwood · « **Reply #250 on:** Sep 11, 20, 07:06:20 PM »

https://t.co/5Ai82nJWx8?amp=1

yodeler · « **Reply #251 on:** Sep 11, 20, 07:36:37 PM »

This may help,
I found this on (https://www.nifc.gov/nicc/sitreprt.pdf) "Bobcat, Angeles NF, USFS. Transfer of command from IMT 2 (EA Silver Team) to IMT 1 (CA Team 1) will occur today".
By moving from Incident Management Team(IMT) Type 2 to 1 changes the operations by activating all command and general staff, creating Divisions, increasing personnel and can include several numbers and types of aircraft.
This should be good news for us.
Jon

Wrightwood · « **Reply #252 on:** Sep 11, 20, 09:11:09 PM »

Twitter
Herb
Cascadia Fire Season
Herb
@barkflight
Air attack is now ordering a lead plane and three LATs to report to Division G (top of the fire).

Elk · « **Reply #253 on:** Sep 11, 20, 09:33:33 PM »

Paul Doherty @pjdohertygis
#BobcatFire Perimeter update (did not go to the national database, added directly to map, sorry for the delay)

Map Link: https://arcg.is/18a4HG

Evacuation Info: https://lacounty.gov/emergency/

Fire Info: https://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/715

Wrightwood · « **Reply #254 on:** Sep 11, 20, 09:34:19 PM »

Twitter
AI6YR
@ai6yrham
#BobcatFire here's where they plan on putting down retardant using air tankers (red line). Parallel to the 39.

Wrightwood · « **Reply #255 on:** Sep 11, 20, 09:51:37 PM »

CA Fire Scanner
@CAFireScanner
AA52 also requesting the VLAT out of San Bernardino + any remaining large air tankers that are still on base there, for the same mission. #BobcatFire

Wrightwood · « **Reply #256 on:** Sep 11, 20, 09:54:54 PM »

Mtn High North being used as landing zone (LZ) for 2 helicopters

Wrightwood · « **Reply #257 on:** Sep 11, 20, 10:06:01 PM »

https://www.flightradar24.com/34.33,-117.87/11

Jim Wilkins · « **Reply #258 on:** Sep 11, 20, 10:16:18 PM »

Quote from: Joe Schmoe on Sep 11, 20, 07:00:03 PM

Thanks Jim. The confusing thing is the contrast between what was a days-long air train coming out of San Bernardino to work the Lake fire, and the lack of aircraft activity on this fire. The inversion layer is practically a constant in the LA basin, but I could see the tops of our 10K-foot peaks during times when the aircraft were parked, so I don't understand how working these fires differs. From my layman's point of view it almost seems like there were a trigger point a few days ago where we gave up on fighting the Bobcat fire and fell back to let it burn up to a very large perimeter.

Also, does the San Gabriel Wilderness designation or the National Monument designation change the fire fighting approach at all? Lastly, I think I recall that the super scoopers are hired by LA County, and this was in LA County land, but I don't think I've ever seen them work in the National Forest. Is that true?

Here ia the biggest problem....Too many fires...too many communities being under direct attack with lives and homes lost and finite resources. When things are slow, you can see those VLATS and LATS coming out of San Bernardino Tanker base at great speeds. The conga line of ships were available to be used then. There are less aircraft on contract on the Federal Roster this year then twenty years ago. We are seeing acreage burn that was unheard of ten years ago. The inversion and sunset are some pretty hard stops on air activity....coupled with being right in the middle of one of the busiest air spaces in the world. Remember...80 percent of where the Bobcat was burning was not conducive to doing anything to the fire....old, contiguous fuels in places where no one should be let alone even be able to stand and resources the are committed to another fire and not available for another assignment. Firefighters have been out for months on these fires around the West.

II don't think the monument deal makes any difference. Nor do I think it did a darn bit of good other then some politicians got their minute in the sun. I believe the Scoopers are a County asset and yes, if available and not needed elsewhere in the county would be used on the Forest. That goes for County Helos and City helos when they are not committed. We have had all those assets working for us over the years. The LA County helos saved our bacon on the second day of the Sheep Fire as flames were cresting the top of Lone Pine Canyon. Our national system of mutual aid and coordination works. When the world is burning, it works a lot slower. Don't think it isn't frustrating to the teams that come in and have great ideas on how to stop the fire but there are no resources left to implement the plan.

Wrightwood · « **Reply #259 on:** Sep 11, 20, 10:41:43 PM »

https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/9c7f785b48ca4724883ef0e679ad1424?fbclid=IwAR1SEVkRckPqMByBQaSo54xs_rmzHma2s6Ciwcky39OiTPhdOozZSvGG3xI