Author Topic: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness  (Read 57274 times)

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Offline MojaveSidecar

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Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« on: Jan 22, 13, 08:44:38 PM »
Hi All

I've been reading/studying extensively much literature about the dire financial straits that our USA and California State economies are in, not to mention the City of San Bernardino.

I dont want this tread to be anything about the politics that got us here... I want to focus on the economic disaster's impact on our community, if any, and how we should prepare for it .....  more along the lines of the same way CERT focuses on earthquakes/forest fire preparedness.

From what I have been studying, and assuming its true,  the USA will have to default on its debt in the coming months or so... and the first effect of such a  default will be a run will be on Jensens, Mt Hardware and the MiniMart.

Assuming such a scenario is true, what should we be doing as a community to be prepared?  In my opinion, it is better to talk about this now, before it "might" happen instead of after the fact.

Should we be stocking up on food and water?

What if Marshall law is declared and we are all forced to relocate to a FEMA camp in Adelanto... would you go?

What if the government comes for our guns etc.... should we resist as a lot of other communities are planning? or should we cave in?

Again... this  thread is not to talk about the rights and wrongs of anything political...  it is just to discuss what, if anything we should do as a community to prepare for an economic disaster along the same lines as CERT prepares for an earthquake or forest fire.


Offline ChrisLynnet

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #1 on: Jan 22, 13, 09:09:18 PM »
Does this thread really belong in this forum? I mean seriously, maybe next I can talk about what to do if aliens land and we do our Independence Day impression. Surely there are other places you can discuss this.

raven

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #2 on: Jan 22, 13, 09:18:48 PM »
Mohavesidecar I think that it is a great topic, but I was just saying to my wife that you won't get very many intelligent responses from this town.  Sad to say, but I just wish somebody would prove me wrong.  And YES that topic does belong on this forum.  It affects us all!  I would be proud to vote that it does belong on this forum!

Offline ChrisLynnet

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #3 on: Jan 22, 13, 09:27:35 PM »
:o

A new topic is up to Wrightwood (the forum owner, not the town). Meanwhile I'll keep preparing for the zombie apocalypse.

I know, I know, I'm going.  8)

raven

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #4 on: Jan 22, 13, 09:31:22 PM »
So you are admitting you are a zombie?  ;)

Offline MojaveSidecar

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #5 on: Jan 22, 13, 10:12:45 PM »
I really want to comply with the rules of this forum.... 

And there seems to be no issue with earthquake/forest fire  preparedness via community CERT...

But it seems as soon as I mention a "Economic Disaster" things seem different.

My only question is ..... Should we as a community be prepared for the coming economic collapse  as we are for the  other CERT events/

Dusty Wagoneer

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #6 on: Jan 22, 13, 10:15:53 PM »
Thank you Mojave for bringing this up.

It would be nice as a small town / Community we could all work together for a way to prepare for any disaster (economic, biological, nuclear, earthquake, or anything else).
But it is VERY sad to say that many think everything is fine will be fine, and "nothing bad will EVER happen here in America.
That and if it does our government will save us. Never mind what we saw during Katrina, and recently on the East Coast during and after Sandy, and the fact the US government did nothing to help any in those disasters. In fact they usually made matters worse.

I would suggest anyone interested in such a thing communicate via PM. It is NEVER good to tell EVERYONE what might have already been put away for such a thing. Otherwise people will get complacent, and just figure that someone else will take care of them once a disaster strikes.

Before moving to WW we lived in a loft complex in downtown LA. There were 400+ units in our building and we did have a disaster preparedness committee. We always talked about having some emergency supplies as a community stored on site, but made sure that the residents would not know the extent of such supplies. It was the individual units that should have had an emergency kit in each of their own units. Of course the number of residents ready for an emergency were a very slim number.

The reason for our emergency readiness there was because we live in CA. We have EQ's here, we have fires here, and who knows what else mother nature might throw our way someday?

It would be great to know what neighbors you could count on if the economy fails, or something else happens. But I think you need to choose those you could trust, and would feel comfortable sharing your preps with?

Offline MojaveSidecar

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #7 on: Jan 22, 13, 10:53:27 PM »
:o

A new topic is up to Wrightwood (the forum owner, not the town). Meanwhile I'll keep preparing for the zombie apocalypse.

I know, I know, I'm going.  8)

I'd love John's input on this since this is his forum..... but any trivial search on the internet would suggest we are a bug ready to hit the windshield economey


So what specifically should we do as a community....

and this is the hardest question...


Should we turn away our unprepared neighbors that need food and water to the  extent that it makes the preppers finally unable to survive... or should we advocate now that besides earthquake, and fire,  we have uncertain political consequences that we have to deal with.... and we should as a community be preparing for...    test question...   buy more CERT water barrellels or less.... a gun or not...   
\
and when the ,,,,,, yoy know what hits the fan.... can you exist for 3-6 months...


As a community, we need to think about setting such boundries....


Offline in my dreams

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #8 on: Jan 23, 13, 12:25:15 AM »
I really wouldn't worry about it. . . and if worse came to worst, it would not happen overnight, unlike a natural disaster. . . which one should really worry about and prepare for.  We'd turn into a barter economy. Look at how people survived in the Great Depression. My family grew their own food (in the Black Hills of SD, no less), foraged, canned, some poached, ate squirrels and rabbits, etc.  Took in boarders, worked what few jobs there were.  And everyone bartered.

Its human nature to land on your feet and make community work when faced with stressful times.  If this were not so, there would not be a human race.  And how is it people manage to live in the Third World in ways we cannot wrap our minds around, and yet they don't sneak into their neighbor's cardboard shack and cut their throat for their piece of bread? 

Offline Nolena

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #9 on: Jan 23, 13, 07:34:39 AM »
These people appear to be prepared.


InTheWood

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #10 on: Jan 23, 13, 07:49:33 AM »
I really wouldn't worry about it. . . and if worse came to worst, it would not happen overnight, unlike a natural disaster. . . which one should really worry about and prepare for.  We'd turn into a barter economy. Look at how people survived in the Great Depression. My family grew their own food (in the Black Hills of SD, no less), foraged, canned, some poached, ate squirrels and rabbits, etc.  Took in boarders, worked what few jobs there were.  And everyone bartered.

Its human nature to land on your feet and make community work when faced with stressful times.  If this were not so, there would not be a human race.  And how is it people manage to live in the Third World in ways we cannot wrap our minds around, and yet they don't sneak into their neighbor's cardboard shack and cut their throat for their piece of bread?

Worry about it? No, but consider the possibility yes.

We all know that there is a possibility of a large earthquake impacting our region. Most of us (I hope) prepare for this by stocking extra food and water etc. Some get CERT training and some even go a bit further and create plans for the possibility. Some people ignore the facts and live in a world where earthquakes don't happen to them.

Looking at the current conditions, and things that are happening in the world and any sane person can see that there is a greater than zero chance that something bad could happen. The possibilities are many, most are not likely, but some are definitely possible.

Just as in the case of the earthquake we all know is possible, some prepare, some plan and others live in a world where bad things don't happen to them... until they do.

It seems to me that all of the awareness in our community about earthquakes and the preparations many have done for that eventuality would stand us in good stead. But thinking about other possibilities, even if they are uncomfortable is probably important as long as it doesn't get out of hand.


raven

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #11 on: Jan 23, 13, 07:59:02 AM »
Nolena - can you please refrain from posting your family pictures!  ;)

Offline tcaarabians

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #12 on: Jan 23, 13, 09:12:35 AM »
Ok Raven.. had to laugh at that one. On the more serious side, its not a bad issue to be discussing. I suppose it could be moved to "Just For Fun".. but that doesn't seem like a good fit to me. Perhaps to "In the News." That way it won't have the connotation of a 'disaster.'  A rose by any other name...

My first question is:  Has anyone read an instructive article as to what to expect if the debt ceiling isn't raised? What are the initial impacts of that and what are the long term impacts of that on both the national and local level.  If you have, please post a link here or wherever it may be moved to on the Forum.

I know for myself, I've investigated a water tank for here should an earthquake interrupt water service. But, then I decided if I can get a water truck in.. I can get the horses out. And, that made more sense to me. As for cat sand (something I never want to run short on).. I'll use dirt. As for TP, I'll use letters from old boyfriends.  I'm stocked up on food.. course if I get down to the sardines that Mom loved.. I will not be happy.

So, I don't think Mojave is necessarily being "Chicken Little" here. I, for one, will be devastated if Jensen's runs out of chow mein.  They don't carry it at Staters.

The debt ceiling will have national impacts if it isn't raised.  Oddly, I think it will be raised.. along with a lot of bartering and 'doomsday' scenarios leading up to a vote. And, I really do wish we weren't in a position as a country to have to consider it again.  It does make sense to me to have a rational discussion of local implications if it isn't raised. We have a new congressional representative here. I'm not raising a political flag here.. I am saying that we can voice our own concerns to that new representative to guide his vote.

So, MojaveSidecar... why do you think there will be a run on local stores if the debt ceiling isn't raised? And, I appreciate the fact that you prefaced your question by stating you didn't want to get into a debate as to how we got here. Cheryl o7o


Offline 3PinkRoses

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #13 on: Jan 23, 13, 09:51:25 AM »
I am in total agreement to seeing this subject brought up and kept alive. YES, we need to prepare, Yes we need to have food and water stored!  We haven't seen the worst of our economy.  I feel we need to prepare for this economic colapse. So much to explore here, and thank you MojaveSideCar for bringing this up. Guaranteed, this thread will help all of us in our little town if we are prepared. The day could come when we will have no other means but to rely on each other, barter, grow, sow, etc... the list is endless. 

CrystalLake

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #14 on: Jan 23, 13, 11:57:06 AM »
FEMA camps and "government come for our guns..." -- good grief.  :)

There are enough legitimate things to worry about in our economic climate without paranoid delusions and NRA/Weapons manufacturing propaganda being added to the list of things to worry about. Serious problems require serious solutions, adding FOX "News" lunacy does not help matters.

Wrightwood is within perhaps 90 driving minutes of some 22.4 million people, a great many who actually believe that if there is another economic upheaval in excess of what we had through 2001 and 2009, they will head to the mountains and "live off the land" with their 40 million handguns and rifles.

Beyond basic Earthquake preparedness that every Californian should have, the storage of food and water for mitigation against economic and civil unrest is pointless in the face of a heavily armed populace that can be expected to flood in and take everything you have, killing whoever has it along the way.

Wrightwood is not unique. Every mountain and desert community has the same problem. In the face of a civil or national emergency, all such communities will be overrun with heavily armed people, the majority of them boasting IQs right up there in the mid 80s, every one of which are motivated to take what people have.

Crystal Lake has the same problem, there is potable drinking water at Crystal Lake in the San Gabriel Watershed, and if civil or national unrest were to take place, any point where drinking water is to be found can be expected to be overrun, the game in the mountains (from bears all the way down to snakes) exterminated and eaten within one week.

My point is that every citizen should be storing gasoline, water, food, batteries and such in a standard Earthquake or Fire kit, enough to get through 30 days or so of civic services being cut off, enough to afford citizens to gather together and plan in the aftermath. The idea that one can plan and mitigate a civil or national upheaval is delusional not to mention paranoid.

I will add that we already have adverse impact from the current Great Recession, we see more and more people squatting in the Angeles National Forest already, many of them living along the East Fork of the San Gabriel River. The pollution from human waste ending up in the river (and thus our drinking water) is truly horrific to the point where there has been periodic cleaning-out of the homeless squatters and illegal miners about twice a year which has managed to bring our water quality back to human consumption levels.

I'll have to read the other comments.  :) But since I work in the cargo locomotive transportation infrastructure industry and have done extensive work with potable water catchment and distribution, sewage, electricity, intercoastal waterway transportation, and telecommunications, much of my annual training covers incident damage and aftermath damage, vandalism and terrorism disruptions of infrastructure, disease control, a broad spectrum of training to ensure myself and my colleagues keep things going in the face of adverse effects, my informed opinion is that there is little you can do to ensure your survival in the face of the levels of upheaval that the OP is worried about.

My opinions only, as always, and only my opinions.

Offline Jirka

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #15 on: Jan 23, 13, 12:19:13 PM »

Offline Jirka

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #16 on: Jan 23, 13, 12:23:04 PM »
CrystalLake, Lots of good points; but how would 20 million get to Wrightwood? The freeways would be jammed! And Wrightwood has very little fresh water . . .

Offline SkierBob

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #17 on: Jan 23, 13, 12:31:41 PM »
Depending on whom you believe, police who protect Social Security Administration officers are either preparing for impending financial doom by purchasing lethal ammo to put down rioting citizens, or they're just making a standard purchase of ammunition for a federal police agency.

It all began last month when the agency, which is primarily responsible for distributing benefits to the disabled and retired people, posted an announcement seeking bids for 174,000 hollow-point bullets.

Each bullet potentially "represents a dead American," wrote retired Maj. Gen. Jerry Curry, an Army vet.



http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/04/us/social-security-bullets/index.html

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/ssabullets.asp <--- this is for John  :P


raven

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #18 on: Jan 23, 13, 01:54:12 PM »
Thanks folks!  I am so pleased to see intelligent response on this subject  because we do have a lot of intelligent neighbors.  Views and opinions are a valuable resource!  I think we should consider everything and keep an open mind!

Offline tcaarabians

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Re: Wrightwood Economic Disaster Awareness/Preparedness
« Reply #19 on: Jan 23, 13, 02:29:11 PM »
Just a note here... as we prepare ourselves for an undefined disaster.. it might be a good idea to understand exactly what to expect.  You know, worst case, best case. Those relying on government benefit programs will be cut off or see their benefits cut?  Emergency services will be cut? School programs will be cut? What? Just a thought here. cheryl o7o